What is the Point of Continual Flame

2011-06-20,09:06 AM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #1

Troll in the Playground

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a truly continual flame

Hey Playgrounders!

My character wants to make a special item for his Pelor-worshiping best friend. Crafting a shard of the sun relic isn't an option because my character doesn't worship Pelor. In any case, I think I have a better idea:

The continual flame spell is handy, except that it is vulnerable to dispelling. What I'd like to do is to prevent that from happening. Here's my plan:

First, I'd need a small-ish piece of adamantine or mithril. I would cast the continual flame on this. Then, I would fill a mold shaped like Pelor's holy symbol with molten glass. Finally, I would (with fire protection placed on myself,) place the continual flame shard inside the molten glass and complete the molding of glass sun disk.

I figure that the glass would block line-of-effect, thereby rendering the continual flame immune to dispel attempts. Even a disjunction should fail. As a bonus, the item is also very symbolic of Pelor.

Would this work as I intend?

Also, I could theoretically replace the glass with glass-steel, or at least cast hardening on the glass to make it more resistant to destruction.

Last edited by Chilingsworth; 2011-06-20 at 09:06 AM.

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Originally Posted by 'Able' Xanthis

This is what a properly motivated caster is like, people. Concussive explosions able to rip the front end of a hummer in twain and Chilling is using them to filter out those who don't make the cut. Those unworthy of his true magistic might.

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2011-06-20,09:12 AM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #2

Ogre in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

It would work, but the item already exists kinda. I think it's called Liquid Sunlight, and, while it's meant to be used against light sensitive enemies, it's basically 20 gp. for an Everburning Torch in bottle.

Avatar by zimmerwald1915

Originally Posted by Divide by Zero

Hulking Hurler can get something like (10^83)d6 damage, which is many orders of magnitude greater than the number of particles in the universe.

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2011-06-20,09:12 AM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #3

Dwarf in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Seems like it would work.

If not by RAW, then rule of cool should make it work.

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2011-06-20,09:12 AM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #4

Bugbear in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Is riverine clear? Expensive, and I don't know how hard it'd be to work with, but it's more than a few steps up from glass if it is.

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2011-06-20,09:14 AM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #5

Ogre in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Use Riverine instead of glass, from Stormwrack. It specifically blocks spell effects like a Wall of Force, but it's vulnerable to disintegration and disjunction.

A glass casing would block line of effect, but it has a trivial amount of hardness and HP, so it could be sundered and destroyed very easily. Also, it's vulnerable to energy effects (and especially sonic).

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2011-06-20,09:52 AM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #6

Troll in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Hmm, I could use riverine to upgrade the item later. I'm low-level right now, so I can't craft it myself and we've been told we'll basically have to do our own crafting, so buying it is not an option.

If/when I get access to riverine, I could encase the glass casing in the stuff. That way, it will be difficult to destroy, and still resistant to disjunction.

Thanks to Pesimismrocks for my awesome avatar, and Gaiyamato for the game that inspired it!
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Nicest thing said of me:

Originally Posted by 'Able' Xanthis

This is what a properly motivated caster is like, people. Concussive explosions able to rip the front end of a hummer in twain and Chilling is using them to filter out those who don't make the cut. Those unworthy of his true magistic might.

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2011-06-20,10:02 AM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #7

Ogre in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Originally Posted by Chilingsworth

Hmm, I could use riverine to upgrade the item later. I'm low-level right now, so I can't craft it myself and we've been told we'll basically have to do our own crafting, so buying it is not an option.

If/when I get access to riverine, I could encase the glass casing in the stuff. That way, it will be difficult to destroy, and still resistant to disjunction.

Checked the spell description for Disjunction, and it appears that you're out of luck. You don't need line of effect. As long as the magical item is within the radius affected by the spell, it gets disjunctioned. The spellcaster would need line of effect between himself and the point in space where he wanted to centre the radius, but that's pretty trivial.

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2011-06-20,10:07 AM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #8

Troll in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Originally Posted by Shadowknight12

Checked the spell description for Disjunction, and it appears that you're out of luck. You don't need line of effect. As long as the magical item is within the radius affected by the spell, it gets disjunctioned. The spellcaster would need line of effect between himself and the point in space where he wanted to centre the radius, but that's pretty trivial.

Drats, Foiled Again!

Oh well, it should still protect against dispells, right?

Even if not, it's still a cool item idea, so I'll try it anyway. Maybe my DM will even like it enough to let it work as I hoped.

Thanks to Pesimismrocks for my awesome avatar, and Gaiyamato for the game that inspired it!
Previous Avatars:

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Thanks to Kymme

Nicest thing said of me:

Originally Posted by 'Able' Xanthis

This is what a properly motivated caster is like, people. Concussive explosions able to rip the front end of a hummer in twain and Chilling is using them to filter out those who don't make the cut. Those unworthy of his true magistic might.

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2011-06-20,10:38 AM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #9

Ogre in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Originally Posted by Chilingsworth

Drats, Foiled Again!

Oh well, it should still protect against dispells, right?

Even if not, it's still a cool item idea, so I'll try it anyway. Maybe my DM will even like it enough to let it work as I hoped.

Terribly sorry, Dispel Magic comes in a 20-feet-radius burst as well. It is protected against targeted dispelling, though.

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2011-06-20,10:59 AM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #10

Troll in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Burst effects are stopped by blocking LoE. The Rules Compendium clarified this. MDJ can't harm the flame if it's encased in Riverine.

For the record: Why are you so worried about the item getting dispeled? It's a minor effect at best, and dispelling it isn't as effect as casting Darkness to negate the light it gives off. Does your DM have a habit of destroying magic items or something?

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2011-06-20,12:52 PM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #11

Troll in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Originally Posted by Big Fau

Burst effects are stopped by blocking LoE. The Rules Compendium clarified this. MDJ can't harm the flame if it's encased in Riverine.

For the record: Why are you so worried about the item getting dispeled? It's a minor effect at best, and dispelling it isn't as effect as casting Darkness to negate the light it gives off. Does your DM have a habit of destroying magic items or something?

I'm not worried about it being dispelled, per say. I'm just trying to make a truly unquenchable light of Pelor item for my character's Pelorian paladin buddy -- Ideally, something that even if the paladin got killed, his vile foes would be hard-pressed to destroy.

Thanks to Pesimismrocks for my awesome avatar, and Gaiyamato for the game that inspired it!
Previous Avatars:

Spoiler

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Thanks to Kymme

Nicest thing said of me:

Originally Posted by 'Able' Xanthis

This is what a properly motivated caster is like, people. Concussive explosions able to rip the front end of a hummer in twain and Chilling is using them to filter out those who don't make the cut. Those unworthy of his true magistic might.

---

2011-06-20,01:19 PM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #12

Troll in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

XP "A truly continual flame" sounds like something you'd call the board moderators in to deal with.

This is probably cheating, but you could get a truly continual flame from Limited Wish. It's not out of line with the power level, and you don't have to worry about it being bypassed by anything other than Wish/Miracle, at which point there wouldn't be anything you could do anyhow.

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2011-06-20,03:03 PM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #13

Firbolg in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Take a riventine bead, get continual flame cast on it in as high a spell slot as posible (so it will ignore darkness effect of lower spell level), and then place that bead in a riventine orb slightly bigger than the bead with no openings.

Now it will take two disjunctions or desntigrations to destroy the flame. It will ignore most darkness spells, and it will only be supressed by dispell magic (as the area effect version only supresses magic items).

If you really want to go crazy, find a way to get continual flame cast as a supernatural ability (there are a few ways to get spells turn into this, but I don't rember any off hand). Now it is undespellable.

In therory a wish spell could replicate continual flame as a supernatural effect (with DM premision, not like it's going to break the game), so that may work.

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2011-06-20,04:51 PM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #14

Titan in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Originally Posted by Shadowknight12

Checked the spell description for Disjunction, and it appears that you're out of luck. You don't need line of effect. As long as the magical item is within the radius affected by the spell, it gets disjunctioned. The spellcaster would need line of effect between himself and the point in space where he wanted to centre the radius, but that's pretty trivial.

It's not in the spell descriptions it's in the magic rules. Any interposing barrier will stop a burst effect. So theoretically I believe this works, as completely surrounding the object with glass provides total cover.

Last edited by ericgrau; 2011-06-20 at 04:53 PM.

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2011-06-20,04:56 PM (ISO 8601) - Top - End - #15

Ogre in the Playground

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Re: a truly continual flame

Seriously. Non-magical Everburning Torch. In a vial. Liquid Sunlight. 20 gp. Complete Scoundrel page 110. Check it out.

Avatar by zimmerwald1915

Originally Posted by Divide by Zero

Hulking Hurler can get something like (10^83)d6 damage, which is many orders of magnitude greater than the number of particles in the universe.

Characters:

Spoiler

Show

Current characters: None, looking for a game.

Homebrew!

Wow, it's been a while. Sorry for the unexplained absence!

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Source: https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?203936-a-truly-continual-flame

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